Senator Mahmud Kanti Bello, erstwhile Senate Majority Whip, has
literally traversed all major political parties, including PDP, ANPP
and CPC. Now, he is a member of the newly registered All Progressives
Congress (APC). In this interview, he laments the danger corruption
posed to the future survival of this country, insisting that only
Buhari can deal with the menace. Excerpts:
You have traversed literally all major political parties- PDP, ANPP
and CPC. Are you now comfortable in APC?
Yes, so far I am comfortable. We just had our stakeholders' meeting
and I am happy that the Interim National Chairman has set out a well
articulated manifesto for the party. We are out to check insecurity,
devolution of power, agricultural development for food security aS
well as free education. As you have said, I have been in this
political game for quite some time. My own understanding is that we
are giving this country something that will salvage the economy from
the clutches of indiscipline, high level of corruption and insincere
leadership. I am also happy that all our governors and leaders are
committed to moving this country forward. You know I am a grassroots
politician and from all that I have heard, Nigerians are very happy
about the party. Nigerians want a party that is different from PDP.
They don't want what has happened in the defunct parties. They want an
honest democratic party. They want people to be elected on merit. And
this is why this interim leadership must live by example. If they do
very well, their names will be written in gold. If they mess up with
their selfish interest, there will be problem for the party and it
will spell doom for Nigeria.
Are you in a nutshell saying that the party is now well positioned to
bring about the change people are yearning for?
I will rather say that the party is now well named. You cannot say a
party is well positioned when you have not elected your executive. The
people that are there are all interim. They were selected or appointed
by our previous parties. Yes, we have confidence in them, but
Nigerians should be given opportunity to elect their leaders when the
time comes for election. And it should be from ward level to the
national level. So, if this interim management is honest from
registration to congress, then they have done great for Nigeria. If
they mess up and bring certain interests in, then they mess up this
country, mess up the party and mess up the hope of Nigeria. At this
movement, a savior for Nigeria has been borne. The only thing is that
this baby should be nursed very well.
As a core Northern leader, how acceptable is APC in the north?
Northerners in general wanted a change because they are not happy. The
reason they are not happy is that they have seen that their standard
of living has gone down. If you go to Kano, so many factories have
closed down. There is no longer textile industry you know. Before this
government came in, we knew how many mega wattS of electricity we were
generating. Today, we are generating less than 3,000 mega watts. There
is nothing to show for the trillion of naira invested in the power
sector. People are no fools. No industry can grow without regular
electricity. Even we cannot cope with our domestic consumption. Every
single northerner wanted a change from what is happening today. I
joined the CPC because I followed the people. I wanted to be where the
people are. It has been made clear that if we are able to win and get
to power, we are going to pursue devolution of power, we are going to
do our best to develop agriculture to ensure food security, and we are
going to provide good health care system. These are not mere wishful
thinking. The security situation must be improved; educational system
must be improved, electricity must be improved, if this country is to
move forward. People must have gainful employment. And the great
sector that can employ people is Agriculture. No northerner is happy
to see young Al-Majiri on the streets begging because it is a time
bomb; it is like explosive ready to blast off. Something should be
done. That is why some of us out of patriotism prayed so that there
will be merger. And thank God that merger has now become a reality.
Now, the next stage is for the people who are put in charge to move
the merger forward. This is the most critical period in the life of
the party. So, the Interim management must live above board. I am not
saying we haven't got confidence in them; we have. But we are
watching. They must make sure that they do things right. If any of
them is interested in going for any elective position, he must resign
from management position. I believe not only northerners but the
entire Nigerians are interested in embracing the party. It is a
necessity.
There is a general apprehension that there may be a clash of interests
when the time comes for nomination of presidential candidate of the
party. Don't you think so?
If you have listened to me carefully, not only the presidential
candidate, but even election into party positions must be done
transparently because that is what will show to Nigerians whether
there will be honesty or not.
What about zoning matter?
There is no zoning in our party's constitution. After the registration
of members, there will be congresses. If the registration is hijacked
by some people for personal interest, then there will be problem.
Every Nigerian who wants to be registered should be registered and
should be given equal treatment. I know there are some bad gangs
within the party, but we are watching them. Some of us are in this
party with our lives and our souls for the interest of this country.
And we will do everything possible to make it work. We are not going
to leave any stone unturned to make it succeed.
There is also insinuation of a crack in the party. Is there no crack
in the merger?
I am yet to see it. This is a new born baby. It was born a couple of
weeks ago when it was registered and we just did the naming ceremony
at our stakeholders' meeting. Now, we have to nurse the baby to become
a man. This is a developmental stage. At developmental stage, you
cannot have a crack. Anybody who talks of crack is just speaking for
PDP.
With your Interim Management, how do you think APC is going to cope
with the aspect of the Electoral Act that stipulates that election
must take place six months before the handover, which is likely to be
November or December next year?
God willing, we should be able to conclude our congresses by the end
of November. If we conclude congresses by the end of November, we have
thirteen months within which to field candidates. And every hand will
be on deck to move this country forward. If we are willing, we can
make it. All we want is that it must be different from PDP. Nigerians
expect a party that is different from PDP and crisis-free.
Putting the card on the table; is there a way your party can actually
run away from the issue of zoning because majority of northern
political elders want power shift?
Which zoning? Zoning is not part of the constitution of APC. There is
no where zoning is mentioned. But there is what they call fairness.
The most important thing is capability, credibility and someone who
can do the job. So, don't bring in the issue of zoning. It is not part
of our constitution. It is part of the constitution of the previous
PDP. I said previous PDP because Jonathan kicked against it. And that
is one of the things that made me to disagree with him. If I sat down
with you and agreed on how we want to live together, you cannot just
change the rule because you want an advantage. And that is what makes
the difference between APC and the PDP. I am not against Jonathan
because he is from the South-South and I am a Northerner. There is a
rule that is supposed to be obeyed. If we start disobeying rules,
there will be trouble and that is why the PDP is in crisis today. And
they will continue to have problem because a lot of people want to cut
corners. That is what I am saying to the new party; don't allow that
to happen. Be honest in your dealing with people.
Apparently, if power shift cannot be actualized under the PDP, the
North will be looking towards the APC.
(Cuts in). That is what will help the APC to win. If it is a strategy
to field a northerner so that we can win, so be it. But then, we
should field a Northerner that is good enough, we should field a
Northerner that is not corrupt, we should field a Northerner that is
strong, we should field a Northerner that is liked by the people, we
should field a Northerner that has the capacity to do the job. And
that Northerner we know is in the party and he can do it. We need
somebody who can stamp out corruption. Corruption is our cancer in
this country. Why do we spend trillion of naira on the power sector to
generate just 3000 mega watts? Why is it that somebody who collected
pension and embezzled it is still working freely? We need somebody
who will kill that corruption. And we have it from the North. But if
members of the party decide that other person from other part of the
country should run, so be it.
Majority of core Northerners believe that we have had a divided nation
under this presidency. Do you agree with them?
Yes, of course. And not only that, we are drifting dangerously towards
religious dispute. But thank God, there are lot of sensible people who
kept quiet. Some did not even want to talk about it because it will
fuel the crisis. No country has ever survived a religious war. We have
had sectional war; we were able to come out of it stronger. But God
forbid, it is going to be very difficult for us to survive a religious
war. I am not a religious bigot. All I want is a Northerner who is
honest, who is not corrupt and who is not a religious bigot. What
Jonathan has done to this country is not good. Look at his
appointment, his little Bayelsa State with eight local governments has
the highest number of political appointees. Bayelsa is far less that
my senatorial district where I have run and won senate seat four
times.
It is one and a half times bigger than Bayelsa. Yet, the total number
of people he employed since he came into power is the highest in the
country. Where is the honesty? What is he trying to portray? We need
open and large hearted president. We need somebody who is ready to
listen to criticism without any ill-feeling towards anybody. What we
have been suffering in this country is a situation where little boys
without experience are being made our leaders. And that is why there
is no respect for the party. We need a disciplined society and that is
why we need Buhari because he has the capacity to instill discipline
and stop corruption. If the North presents him, I hope the party will
accept him.
What then is the assurance that APC will not drift towards
sectionalism when election time comes?
Our party is built on certain principles. I have never thought or
agreed with devolution of power. But now that my party has come up
with it, I see a lot of wisdom in it. We say we want to generate
power; we have to have a way of generating it. With all the noise Sule
Lamido, Rabiu Kwankwaso and their group of five governors are making,
have they ever talked about the incapacity of Jonathan to produce
goods for Nigerians? Rather, they have been talking about power shift.
If power must come to the North, it has to come to the North for a
purpose. Nigeria is 53. When are we going to stop the issue of North,
South, East and West? We need a leader that can really change this
country. If we don't, there will be problem in this country. Out of
population of 160 million people, over 90 million are here in the
North. And I can assure you over 50 million youths are roaming the
streets without work and proper education. It is a big time bomb. I
have to contribute my quota to make sure it doesn't explode. People
are angry. And we are not even improving agriculture. We only rely on
oil from Bayelsa. We are jokers. We can produce enough food for the
whole of African continent, but we are not doing that. Instead, we are
importing rice from China and Thailand. We need a leader to change
this. We need a patriotic leader. When I say we need Buhari it is not
because he is a Northerner or he is from Katsina, it is because cancer
is our problem and we need to deal with it.
Isn't that at variance with the current agitation for the younger
generation to assume the mantle of leadership?
My friend, where were you when Mandela became President in South
Africa? We need somebody who can rule for four years at least to stop
this cancer. Do you agree with me that Buhari is not corrupt? Do you
agree with me also that the problem of this country is corruption? We
need to stop corruption. We have sold our properties at a corrupt
rate. God has endowed this country, we only have useless leaders. We
have to change it. That is why I am sacrificing myself to help.
Is there any assurance that some of your party members will be ready
to drop their ambitions for the general interest of this country?
That is what we are saying. We are saying that if you have an
ambition, drop it and let's build something first of all. I said it
from the beginning that there are some people even in the interim
management who have ambition. I am begging them not to show the
ambition now. But if they are really ambitious, they should move aside
and let people who have no ambition and are willing to serve take over
the affairs of the party. The party has come up with a noble
objective. But it is one thing to have good plan on paper,
implementation is another. And, of course, to implement, you need
honesty of purpose. Besides, people have to be convinced that you are
not a crook.
Concerning the issue of tenure elongation in the ongoing constitution
review, what is the duration of tenure you think we need in this
country?
It is not even the tenure that bothers me, but the pervasive
corruption that we have had to fight over the years to the extent that
the judiciary is becoming one kind of thing. Today, the judiciary
interprets the constitution, gives judgment and even makes law outside
the thinking of the legislature. There are certain things that have
been done unconstitutionally which the judiciary just left like that.
As far as I am concerned, it is not how long you stay in power that
matters, but how effective you were while in power. The late Gen
Murtala Muhammed only stayed in power for just six months and he was
very effective. He was fully in charge and well focused. As far as I
am concerned, the four or eight-year tenure we adopt is okay. But when
somebody died, you took over, served out the term, and then you still
want to serve eight-year term is typically African. Even if you
correct the constitution, once a president is there, there will be one
High Court Judge who will say constitutionally it is right to do it.
For me,
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